[3ED/4ED] New Blood Magic

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The Undying
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Re: [3ED/4ED] New Blood Magic

Post by The Undying » Wed Jan 04, 2017 8:48 am

Explaining the mechanics of Thread Items isn't something a player should really be exposed to, which is why it's in the GMG. It's not the end of the world, but it removes some of the magic. In earlier editions, there was much more about the mechanical elements of thread items and the difference between, I guess, power level, without delving further into it. I consider the exclusion of this in the Player's Guide kind of nudge to say "hey, player's shouldn't be provided this." Enchanters muddy the water since they'd know more about the mechanics, but still, there's a limit to how much they should have, ESP if the GM wants to change some of the elements in their universe. But, that's just my viewpoint.

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RazanMG
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Re: [3ED/4ED] New Blood Magic

Post by RazanMG » Thu Jan 05, 2017 1:15 pm

As this is rather in Wizards capabilities, it should have rather considerable cost.

So I give you:

Bloodskin Matrix - Threadweaving knack, minimum rank 9
When used blood patterns show on adepts skin. - a bit of fluff :P
The adept makes Threadweaving test with a difficulty of Reattuning of the desired spell to be placed in Bloodskin Matrix. The adept declares how many Strain he wants to take, minimum is Circle of desired spell. If successful Bloodskin Matrix is created on adepts skin, and adept takes declared Strain, if test wasn't successful he does not take any Strain. Bloodskin Matrix last for Strain taken rounds +1. Each additional Success reduce Strain cost by -1, to a minimum of 1. Bloodskin Matrix is created with desired spell already attuned to it.

So lets say adept wants to create Bloodskin Matrix with Circle 5 spell. He declares how many Strain he wants to take, in this example at least 5 Strain (but can take more to make it last longer). He makes Threadweaving test (14), if Test was successful he takes declared Strain, reduced by additional successes, if test wasn't successful he does not take any Strain.

Tattered Rags
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Re: [3ED/4ED] New Blood Magic

Post by Tattered Rags » Thu Jan 05, 2017 3:12 pm

If it appears on the skin, can someone make a called shot against it with a physical attack to damage it (rather than the astral one needed to attack normal matrices)?
Adventure I'm running:
Under the Stars

Adventure GM post-mortem:
Under the Stars Postmortem

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The Undying
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Re: [3ED/4ED] New Blood Magic

Post by The Undying » Thu Jan 05, 2017 11:52 pm

We're swerving a bit here. I think Kosmit was specifically looking for Blood Magic oriented ideas or solutions. I'm down with using Knacks to help in that process, though (especially when something appears strong, I'd really like to see some meaningful investment required, and nothing says investment like LP).

That being said, especially with the name of this Knack, the damage really should be Blood Damage. Strain is touchy in that it's super easy to heal. There's an old (current?) optional rule that allowed Strain to just be insta-healed overnight. Plus, Strain is really seen as something temporary - a brief push. Blood Damage, though, is significant, and it's often associated with a "you can't do this again until you heal the old Blood Damage." That's a design element that can be used to help adjust cost/power.

Also, I'm not sure why you wouldn't spend the Strain on a test failure. Failure doesn't mean you didn't try. The amount of Strain indicates the level of focus and effort required in the attempt. Yeah, it sucks if you don't succeed because that's wasted Health, but I don't see a good reason to credit back the Strain.

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Kosmit
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Re: [3ED/4ED] New Blood Magic

Post by Kosmit » Fri Jan 06, 2017 4:53 am

I think I will stick with a Blood Wound and Blood Magic Damage equal to spell circle as a cost.

I am still concerned about duration but I am trying to imagine it as energy surge so maybe only one cast per Blood Matrix would be allowed.

It will come with Blood Magic theme "one time cost for high bonus" as with pushing talents. And I really don't want to put it into Knack. Blood Magic is Blood Magic ;) It can be totally different than what we have already (spells, talents, knacks).


One pretty OP ritual just popped to my mind:

Blood Sacrifice
You can deal damage directly through the use of your Blood. You choose the amount of damage you want to deal and then take triple damage dealt as Blood Magic Damage. Target is protected by Mystic Armor but for you no armor provides protection.

I could make it less straighforward if you could choose damage Step (with that you can roll high or low) and take triple the Step (or even triple the damage dealt - watch out for high rolls :D).

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The Undying
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Re: [3ED/4ED] New Blood Magic

Post by The Undying » Fri Jan 06, 2017 5:21 am

I don't think you can justify a blood magic only damage ability. There's just really nothing in the existing universe to allow it - there's no link for the damage to occur over and nothing actually pushing it forward.

For what it's worth, you should really keep in mind that Blood Magic is still very much a necessary evil. Sacrifice for the sake of power is the stuff of Horrors, and only certain varieties of it are basically socially acceptable. Nethermancers are already seen as kind of untouchables caste to a degree, but your traveling companions (other PCs) likely look past this, even if they might have some reservations. However, if you started carving yourself up in any of the various manners you've described in this thread, and I were your GM, I would halt things and describe to your companions, using as dark and foreboding language as I can, the fact that you are carving yourself up, doing my best to plant the seed in their heads that you're acting under some kind of compulsion like a horror mark ... because, really, in universe, that's what should be happening. They should be all but horrified, and they should begin to have reservations about you. And as word spreads of this kind of stuff, you're likely to find more high prices, closed doors, and generally wary glances, with the extent depending on your Hero rank.

Food for thought.

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Kosmit
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Re: [3ED/4ED] New Blood Magic

Post by Kosmit » Fri Jan 06, 2017 8:51 am

Depends how Blood Magic is viewed in your Barsaive ;) Some have it more common and not that bad ;)

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The Undying
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Re: [3ED/4ED] New Blood Magic

Post by The Undying » Fri Jan 06, 2017 9:52 am

I'm talking Rules As Written (RAW). Individual tables and scenario lore throws things out of whack. Just because your table hasn't balked at a few Blood Charms, I wouldn't necessarily assume that Blood Magic is Super A+ #1 in said universe. If it is, more power to ya, let your life blood light your path to glory!
Blood Magic, Player's Guide, pg 238 wrote:Blood magic offers a vivid reminder of the torments people inflicted on themselves in the days before and during the Scourge. As a result, ordinary citizens often feel suspicious of adepts who use blood magic. Most Barsaivians work hard at putting the devastation of the Horrors out of their minds, and choose to reject everything that blood magic represents—even its potential for helping those still battling the remnants of the Horrors.

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Kosmit
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Re: [3ED/4ED] New Blood Magic

Post by Kosmit » Fri Jan 06, 2017 10:59 am

And then in the GMG there is section that says you can treat It as you want ;)

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The Undying
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Re: [3ED/4ED] New Blood Magic

Post by The Undying » Fri Jan 06, 2017 11:12 am

Like I said, man, if your table is different, then go forth!

EVERYTHING is negotiable on a table-to-table basis. The only common element we as a community have as a baseline is the stuff that actually says "this is what we suggestion" or "this is the basic universe described in the book." Gotta start somewhere, right?

All I'm saying is that it sounds like you're talking about things as a PLAYER in this thread, not as the GM. If you haven't had a talk with your GM about the extent of some of the things you want to do, like in this thread, then you might want to. Because, in the baseline, this kind of stuff would likely not be received well.

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