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FASA Games, Inc.FASA Games Forums and News 2019-06-25T19:07:26 http://www.fasagames.com/forum/app.php/feed/topic/1273 2019-06-25T19:07:262019-06-25T19:07:26 http://www.fasagames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1273&p=9867#p9867 <![CDATA[Re: Weak Horrors]]>
lanir wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 9:28 pm
It might be a bit hard to work into an adventure in any case unless you have characters invested in curing the Mad Pasions.
Been away from the forums for a bit, so apologies for nethering this, but your comment about curing the Mad Passions prompted me to share this link to the old forum with an idea I had for just that. Sadly, the pages are a bit on the wonky side whenever I visit, so it looks like some pieces are missing. Just scroll past all the error text to get to the posts.

https://fasagames.com/archiveforum/view ... =18&t=1754

Thankfully I saved it for my own use later, so the important missing portion is here (assuming it's even missing when you look at it).
Spoiler:
Clearly there are a multitude of ways to work this in, from excerpts of the Books of Harrow to a dragon seeking a new weapon, perhaps having a second group tailing the first and collecting True Elements while the players collect Horror Elements. The dragon can then later bring the players in on the secret because the second group needs some saving.


Personally, in a campaign that ends with curing a Passion, I'd make Passions and their Questors center.


Questors of Garlen, Astendar, Mynbruje, etc., begin employing the players. Eventually, a Questor of Lochost puts them on the trail of creating Sufferance and Renewal, as a way to free the Passions enslaved by madness. At this point the players are probably used to Questors giving them jobs, but I'd play up the oddity of a LONE Questor seeking them out. This person also stresses the secrecy needed, as they fear one of the Mad Passions or Horrors finding out.


This Lochost Questor is actually a Questor of Vestrial who thinks Vestrial wants Lochost driven mad. In actuality Vestrial seeks to cure Raggok. Because reasons. (Perhaps a long-term plan to overthrow Horrors and take their place, or, ya know, Vestrial's nuts.)


Through their work, the Vestrial Questor is revealed. Ideally, this brings the players into contact with a Questor of Rashomon, or a player becomes one.


Yes, that's a Questor of RASHOMON.


As things move forward the players get to meet at a council of the Passions, something never before done. All of the sane Passions are there, plus one Questor each, and the Questor of Rashomon. They plead with the players "to cure our lost brother Rashomon", even though Vestrial wants it. Dis crashes the party and exclaims great rewards to whomever kills Lochost, or drives her Mad.


Later a Questor of Raggok, a skeletal figure wrapped in death and maggots, attempts to persuade the players to go after the other Passions, even agreeing to reward them if they help Dis.


Vestrial contacts them again near the close, crazily requesting, again, that they cure Raggok. His only reasoning he'll give is that he's always wanted to kill a Great Dragon.


If the players take on Raggok, the follow on adventure has Rashomon Questors leading efforts against Iopos.


Anything could happen, even curing Vestrial or just killing Astendar.


This all works even better if players are Questors, and it becomes even more likely that they will become ones during this adventure. If one becomes a Questor of Rashomon, all the better.


I'd even throw in Questors of Erendis and a sane Vestrial. They are possible because of the POTENTIAL of them being healed. When the players complete the quest and Sufferance and Renewal are destroyed, then the Questors of still Mad Passions are themselves driven mad and serve the Mad versions.

Statistics:Posted by Tattered Rags — Tue Jun 25, 2019 7:07 pm


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2019-06-08T19:07:102019-06-08T19:07:10 http://www.fasagames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1273&p=9762#p9762 <![CDATA[Re: Weak Horrors]]>
Basically I wanted to go for less jump horror and more psychological horror in my game. So this beastie is a kind of revenant. Details in the spoiler tag.
Spoiler:
The Horror itself is a little eel-like grub or something that burrows it's way into dead flesh. It flays the soul back into the corpse but does not revive it. This type of Horror works best if the players knew the victim beforehand. My plan is to have the PCs make a hard choice during a difficult spot that causes them to leave behind an NPC helper, who will become infected by this Horror and later rejoin the group.

I'd debated dividing these into two types, drones that are like the Horrors with animal intelligence who would just go along for the ride and more intelligent queens capable of reproducing, puppeting their host at will and speaking on their own.

Description: The corpse continues to decay but much more slowly than normal. In the end it will mummefy but in the interim organs and some fleshy bits will rot or be devoured by parasites (yes rotting and mummefication are contradictory but it's a standard zombie trope so screw it, it's magic). Feel free to describe unpleasant odors, apparently unnecessary bits or parasites dropping off, momentarily mushy speech due to same.

The horror elements: Aside from the descriptive bits, the characters sense of touch is dulled as if their whole body were like a limb that's partially fallen asleep but the pins and needles of renewed circulation never come. Pain is a thing of the past but wounds will never heal; they require physical repair such as stitching, nailing splints into place, etc. All touch, temperature and pain information is at a remove, as though it's happening to someone else. The reanimated character always has a goal of some sort, whether it's to protect a loved one, get revenge, etc. You can decide whether that means the Horror influences the host or whether the Horror must gain the cooperation of the host to reanimate it. Once reanimated the host is stuck with their situation until they fall apart or someone else removes the Horror (the host cannot cooperate with this, the Horror and it's own fear will compel it to act out to avoid this fate).

What the Horror gets out of it: Primarily it feeds on the angst of the victim who's going through the process of watching their body rot around them and struggling to complete some goal. Victims also have some strong motivations of their own to lash out and this makes for a good secondary source of "food" for the Horror.

Ideas for system rules: This probably works better as a Mask (see the Earthdawn Companion: basically a template rather than a stand-alone creature write-up). It should get some significant armor rating added but wounds would degrate the armor. Maybe a little wound threshold boost? Recovery tests cannot heal wounds. They're going to slowly fall apart no matter what. Remove the Horror and the soul flees, leaving just a corpse at whatever stage of rot it had progressed to. Only Namegivers give the Horror sustenance but other creature might carry one.

Inspirations: The Crow, Laura Moon from American Gods, Sayaka from Puella Magi Madoka Magica.

Statistics:Posted by lanir — Sat Jun 08, 2019 7:07 pm


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2019-06-08T18:22:062019-06-08T18:22:06 http://www.fasagames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1273&p=9761#p9761 <![CDATA[Re: Weak Horrors]]>
Mcgarnagle wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 11:54 pm
I don’t want to side track this thread but it’d be awesome if you posted a new thread with some examples of how you brought it all together. I love trying to interweave stories and NPCs together in different ways in an effort to make the world feel alive and lived in by other people besides the player characters.
I started this thread for that discussion:

Weaving Plots: Making World Look Alive

Statistics:Posted by lanir — Sat Jun 08, 2019 6:22 pm


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2019-06-08T04:33:292019-06-08T04:33:29 http://www.fasagames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1273&p=9756#p9756 <![CDATA[Re: Weak Horrors]]>
Somewhere along the way, the horror marks the PCs and is causing them all kinds of grief; this aspect has to be played out and emphasize to the max. The PCs have to feel the huge negative impact this horror is having on their lives.

My campaign takes place before and during the events found in Prelude to War, so spoilers ahead:
Spoiler:
the PCs are tasked with investigating the status of the life rocks trapped under the Theran behemoth, Triumph. When the discover the obsidimen are trapped inside and the Tehran’s are powering their defenders of Triumph with its magical energies, the horror makes the PCs an offer. He’ll leave them and remove his horror mark if they get him to the life rocks. If they get him to it, he will be able to unplug Triumph as it were and give Barsaive a fighting chance to drive the Therans out. The only cost is those obsidimen trapped inside will be consumed in horrible agony by the horror. Is it a price worth paying in order to rid arsaive of the Theran outpost?

Statistics:Posted by Mcgarnagle — Sat Jun 08, 2019 4:33 am


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2019-06-07T14:35:352019-06-07T14:35:35 http://www.fasagames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1273&p=9751#p9751 <![CDATA[Re: Weak Horrors]]>
The easiest way to do this is pick two groups* and have them plotting in the background.
Admittedly I have more experience world building than actually running campaigns. Players in my longest most recent campaign were all either new to TTRPGs or Earthdawn, so it was a very slow moving, mostly teaching, campaign and we never really got to the meat before breaking up (schedule changes, the weather, you all know the deal)I was told they enjoyed my DMing. I usually have background groups plotting in overlapping areas of the entire Barsaive map, so anywhere the characters go there they could run into story. Now I actually have to get them there. I try not to develop more than I can chew because like I said, my experience putting a world on the table is limited. I plan to start another campaign sometime next year, and will hopefully get players to do some homework before joining.
This sound like a fantastic technique. I don’t want to side track this thread but it’d be awesome if you posted a new thread with some examples of how you brought it all together.
I would most certainly enjoy ^ that thread. Sounds like one for the "Adventurer's Journal" Subforum. or not, I am no authority.

I am going halt any more of my own speculation about Horrors and the Passions until I have completed my reading of ED4. Just picked up the PG yesterday and started digging in so I can start building characters like crazy. It seems most threads that I have started/dug up have Mataxes replying with "Go read the new books ya dummy" (not his actual words) so I am taking the hint. :D

BUT! I would love to read more about how people have use Horrors/Passions in their games. Maybe in some creative ways? or not. Or wherever this thread goes or doesn't. I have gotten a lot from it already.

Statistics:Posted by Scherme — Fri Jun 07, 2019 2:35 pm


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2019-06-06T23:54:062019-06-06T23:54:06 http://www.fasagames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1273&p=9745#p9745 <![CDATA[Re: Weak Horrors]]>
lanir wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 9:28 pm
The easiest way to do this is pick two groups* and have them plotting in the background. If the adventures at least peripherally relate to their interests, the PCs have a chance to notice them. Until that happens the easy way is to introduce tactical choices based on the location the PCs are fighting in. If they get one of these types of encounter per evening that's enough to play to your strenghts and let the mechanics be a storytelling device. It also gives some visible storytelling until the PCs notice the plots surrounding them.

If that sounds awful, ignore it. Every GM and group is a bit different.

* I usually try for 3 groups because I've been doing this awhile and 3 seems to be the point where you blow people's minds and the whole world starts to feel like it's in motion around them. 2 should be plenty to start with though. You could probably get by with 1 if you wanted.
This sound like a fantastic technique. I don’t want to side track this thread but it’d be awesome if you posted a new thread with some examples of how you brought it all together. I love trying to interweave stories and NPCs together in different ways in an effort to make the world feel alive and lived in by other people besides the player characters.

Statistics:Posted by Mcgarnagle — Thu Jun 06, 2019 11:54 pm


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2019-06-06T21:28:122019-06-06T21:28:12 http://www.fasagames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1273&p=9744#p9744 <![CDATA[Re: Weak Horrors]]> The Space Vampires by Colin Wilson. Some spoilers for it below.
Spoiler:
The titular creatures feed off of energy and human emotions are their fare of choice. Later on it's revealed that their condition and their actions are due to a subsistence diet that barely lets them survive. If they had access to a stable food source large enough to keep them healthy, their actions and morality would be quite different.
I've always found sci-fi and fantasy had more powerful storytelling when they introduced interesting philosophical challenges. But I get that this might be a bit like dragging the Passions through the muck for some people so YMMV. It might be a bit hard to work into an adventure in any case unless you have characters invested in curing the Mad Pasions.
Scherme wrote:
Fri May 24, 2019 1:20 pm
I am mechanics oriented when it comes to playing, it is just how my brain works but I am looking to change that and provide story.
The easiest way to do this is pick two groups* and have them plotting in the background. If the adventures at least peripherally relate to their interests, the PCs have a chance to notice them. Until that happens the easy way is to introduce tactical choices based on the location the PCs are fighting in. If they get one of these types of encounter per evening that's enough to play to your strenghts and let the mechanics be a storytelling device. It also gives some visible storytelling until the PCs notice the plots surrounding them.

If that sounds awful, ignore it. Every GM and group is a bit different.

* I usually try for 3 groups because I've been doing this awhile and 3 seems to be the point where you blow people's minds and the whole world starts to feel like it's in motion around them. 2 should be plenty to start with though. You could probably get by with 1 if you wanted.

Statistics:Posted by lanir — Thu Jun 06, 2019 9:28 pm


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2019-06-04T09:18:242019-06-04T09:18:24 http://www.fasagames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1273&p=9733#p9733 <![CDATA[Re: Weak Horrors]]>
Slimcreeper wrote:
Fri May 24, 2019 3:56 pm
This thread is a-maz-ing.
Agree!

Statistics:Posted by debney — Tue Jun 04, 2019 9:18 am


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2019-05-29T15:43:572019-05-29T15:43:57 http://www.fasagames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1273&p=9704#p9704 <![CDATA[Re: Weak Horrors]]> This indeed opens many possibilities. Questors are actually horror-marked and get the powers via that mark, it only happens that the emotions they gather are on the positive side rather then the unpleasant type :) this can imply they come from the same astral plane but are different species - mabye opposed to each other? One is more like a symbiotic type (passions) the other parasite like (horrors)?

Which also allows some space to introduce yet another type of being - something akin to gods. Beings that feed off energy released when a namegiver dies provided that Namegiver believes (or WILLs it) their pattern will go to their god at the time of death. e.g. true believers. So such Beings would devote their time & effort into making as many believers as possible so they can thrive on their souls... Food for thought here.

Back to the Horrors - we know so little about their origin, any speculation is possible. Let's think of horrors as us humans on earth. In a not-so-distant future we will destroy our planet. It will still sustain life yes, but it will be a miserable place. At that point, terra-forming another planet looks like a good idea, right? So we will look for planets suitable for us, preferably with atmosphere good for breathing and temperatures that would not kill us outright. Horrors might be doing the same - but instead of a planet - another plane of the nether-space, instead of temperature they look for high enough magic level, instead of atmosphere - proper potential for emotion etc.

Statistics:Posted by Avanti — Wed May 29, 2019 3:43 pm


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2019-05-25T13:35:472019-05-25T13:35:47 http://www.fasagames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1273&p=9668#p9668 <![CDATA[Re: Weak Horrors]]>
Thats a nice one. A stranded horror mother with her little horror child fleeing into our sphere to finally feed it properly.

Statistics:Posted by Lursi — Sat May 25, 2019 1:35 pm


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2019-05-24T15:56:172019-05-24T15:56:17 http://www.fasagames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1273&p=9661#p9661 <![CDATA[Re: Weak Horrors]]> Statistics:Posted by Slimcreeper — Fri May 24, 2019 3:56 pm


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2019-05-24T13:20:152019-05-24T13:20:15 http://www.fasagames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1273&p=9660#p9660 <![CDATA[Re: Weak Horrors]]>
lanir wrote:
Fri May 24, 2019 2:24 am
well, what if a Passion is just what a really well fed Horror looks like? What happens then if the Mad Passions start to dip below a certain threshold? What happens if the Horror Hunter or Verjigorm get a cult of true believers? Maybe back home, the Horrors and the Passions used to be far more balanced but somehow the Passions made off with all the food/energy, evolved, and ran off to other worlds. The Horrors are just chasing them down every chance they get (and having an effect on some, such as the Mad Passions) and all the Namegivers are just yummy distractions?
I can't even handle these concepts lol. My first ED game was almost 20 years ago with first edition, and I have played on and off since, most recently with 3E and I still don't know ANYTHING.

The Passions were never a part of our campaigns in any big way, but I hope now that I plan to run my own games, I do not allow my limitations to limit my players. Which is why I have been diving head first into source material. I am mechanics oriented when it comes to playing, it is just how my brain works but I am looking to change that and provide story.
Mataxes wrote:
Fri May 24, 2019 4:10 am
Check out the recently released Questors sourcebook, pages 15-16. The section entitled "Motives".
I cannot wait to get my hands on 4E. I am expecting my first child in a few months so I have set up a pretty strict budget, but it allows me to buy 1 book a month starting next month. I finished the "Live from Barsaive" podcast and I am current with "Legends of Earthdawn" so these forums are getting a good combing now.

Statistics:Posted by Scherme — Fri May 24, 2019 1:20 pm


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2019-05-24T04:10:052019-05-24T04:10:05 http://www.fasagames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1273&p=9659#p9659 <![CDATA[Re: Weak Horrors]]>
lanir wrote:
Fri May 24, 2019 2:24 am
If you really want to mess with your player's heads, especially if they're already familiar with the Earthdawn setting, you could always start linking the Passions and the Horrors...

I doubt that theory will ever make it into a published product but the Horrors and Passions are both mysterious enough and have few enough details printed about what they are and how they work that I don't think there's anything contradicting it.
Check out the recently released Questors sourcebook, pages 15-16. The section entitled "Motives".

Statistics:Posted by Mataxes — Fri May 24, 2019 4:10 am


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2019-05-24T02:24:132019-05-24T02:24:13 http://www.fasagames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1273&p=9658#p9658 <![CDATA[Re: Weak Horrors]]>
But stories in Earthdawn can help build a legend. Verjigorm certainly has one. He wasn't even present this time around but the dragons are still so freaked out about him that they swap tales.

The background story for why Horrors are here has apparently changed over time but I haven't kept up with it. Originally they wanted to strongly hint at but not outright say that some insect spirits had caused the Scourge to happen multiple times to weaken the planet so they could take over. The Horrors were just shock troops that were manipulated (not that they minded the free meal). I think they later removed the insect spirits and their invasion but I'm not aware of them actually replacing that story with anything else.

Personally, due to the nature of how they feed and the swarms that came to Barsaive, I think they might be starved on the other side. When someone feels emotional pain or terror for long enough, there's a measure of jadedness that can occur. And yes, the intelligent Horrors are certainly capable of pushing boundaries and breaking someone more than once if they start to get this way, but even with that there's a limit. You can't be raised in an awful environment where these sorts of things are going on without being partially affected by it, so that cuts out some of what the Horrors could feed on before they even start. Essentially they sound like they actually need untouched populations in order for the more intelligent variety to actually feed.

If you really want to mess with your player's heads, especially if they're already familiar with the Earthdawn setting, you could always start linking the Passions and the Horrors. According to the published story they're both all about the emotions of Namegivers. One specializes in devotion, the other pain and terror. Where you can go with that... well, what if a Passion is just what a really well fed Horror looks like? What happens then if the Mad Passions start to dip below a certain threshold? What happens if the Horror Hunter or Verjigorm get a cult of true believers? Maybe back home, the Horrors and the Passions used to be far more balanced but somehow the Passions made off with all the food/energy, evolved, and ran off to other worlds. The Horrors are just chasing them down every chance they get (and having an effect on some, such as the Mad Passions) and all the Namegivers are just yummy distractions? I doubt that theory will ever make it into a published product but the Horrors and Passions are both mysterious enough and have few enough details printed about what they are and how they work that I don't think there's anything contradicting it.

Statistics:Posted by lanir — Fri May 24, 2019 2:24 am


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2019-05-23T20:18:182019-05-23T20:18:18 http://www.fasagames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1273&p=9653#p9653 <![CDATA[Re: Weak Horrors]]> The story tells of lands untouched by Verjigorm, I don't believe the world was its to create. - cherry picked lol

The caveat to my take on the facts is that Verjigorm is the most powerful Horror that the physical world has experienced, the most fearsome Horror dragons and other Name-givers alike are aware of. Whom may have even been the origin of those Name-givers.

but! is Verjigorm actually THE most powerful horror?

Horrors- Page 69
Game Information
Verjigorm, the Great
Hunter, is perhaps the most
powerful and feared Horror in
the Earthdawn universe.
perhaps?

Yeah probably. :D

That "perhaps" occurs a couple times when describing Verjigorms power, as was probably only added so developers were not forced to contradict it if there were ever plans to make a more powerful Horror.

Statistics:Posted by Scherme — Thu May 23, 2019 8:18 pm


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